Author Topic: "Crappy FAs"  (Read 38072 times)

mungeclimber

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"Crappy FAs"
« on: December 07, 2014, 07:28:41 PM »
I have a certain amount of respect for crappy FA's.

There is something telling about this post that resonates with me. What it says, I think, is that the FA's subjective experience is deserving of respect despite the "outcome" aka the collective post hoc judgment of the aesthetic qualities of the line.

So many times this antecedent evaluation of aesthetics is born from the "must be fun" commandment. Garbage climbs being, per se not fun. I think at times, without the loss-leading 'crappy' lines being established as a big 'FU' to a collective herd mentality about the supposed value of a climb, we become pushed along the distribution curve to the middle and mediocre.

Exceptionality, in the form of garbage climbs, has a signifying value all it's own in reasserting what the standard deviation can and should be.

Take for example Fritz's story about an FA in the backcountry of Idaho (?) where they climbed several, horribly loose with big blocks, pitches. It was a direct line, but never reported. But in reading about it, the idea of how terrible it was reset my calculation. So horrible you wouldn't ever report it, but it being a directissima, and still no reportage?

Choss is the yin to the yang. The dark to the light. The terrifying to the fun.
On Aid at Pinns... It's all A1 til it crumbles. - Munge

F4?

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2014, 07:34:56 PM »
All of my routes are ****.
I'm not worthy.

waldo

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2014, 08:09:19 PM »
If it was bad enough for me to worry that friends would get curious, get on it and get hurt, I'd keep my mouth shut.  That only happened once or twice.  Hell, I've even forgotten what we did and where we did it. 

mynameismud

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2014, 08:29:19 PM »
For me it was a matter of really liking to climb.  Initially I just wanted to climb so anything that was within my abilities was on the list.  After a bit I started seeking out routes with as many stars as possible.  After years of climbing I noticed many of the really good climbs blurred together but the routes with less stars really stood out and on occasion had plenty of character.  What also surprised me is some of the no star routes had some perfect pitches or super good sections.  These routes sometimes had diversity and character that fully stared routes did not have.  The other contributor was the fact that I fell in love with the Pinnacles which has quite a few less than optimal routes.  I suppose another contributor is many of the lines that I have put up are not what most people would consider classics.  So there is some guilt by association.  

Here's to sweat in your eye

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2014, 06:54:35 AM »
 Like a race where no blue, red or white ribbons are given. If you trip, road rash on your face or breaking something are probable. The finish line is so sweet, even though no one is there but you.

 I watched Jim tapping holds yesterday. When I reach a good sized one he tells me "the left side is good". So I tap it and the left is solid sounding, the right side sounds faintly hollow.

 Later in the day I blew off a good size hold at the crux of The Back Nine. Aaron used this for both a hand and foothold. My extra 30 lbs plus both pairs of approach shoes were to much for it. Everything was loose at the crux, and a lot of the rest of the route was suspect. I was on top rope.

Kudos to the FAs for getting some of those bolts in.

I won't forget climbing this with Aaron.

 I suggest changing the name to "the nine holes out the back of my head from playing roulette". The view was spectacular.
Causing trouble when not climbing.

clink

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2014, 07:09:28 AM »
Quote
If it was bad enough for me to worry that friends would get curious, get on it and get hurt, I'd keep my mouth shut.

Stick your head in a cannon, light the fuse and let's see what happens routes?

Charlie Chaplin and the Texas Chainsaw Massacre, except not funny.

Yesterday we were safe, Aaron had me laughing so hard I could hardly climb.
Causing trouble when not climbing.

Brad Young

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2014, 07:15:41 AM »
Oh yeah, I told you I'd repost Vicki's condor video from January 2010, when we started those routes up there:



If a line looks nice to those who put it up, it's worth the first ascent effort. If subsequent parties don't "like" it, oh well. I more enjoyed the "ATDS" route I led (which I hadn't done before) when I was there with Roger, than I enjoyed my 14th lap up Lava Falls.

Others disagree, finding repeat trips up super quality routes similar to "visiting with good friends."

JC w KC redux

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2014, 12:20:04 PM »
Later in the day I blew off a good size hold at the crux of The Back Nine. Aaron used this for both a hand and foothold. My extra 30 lbs plus both pairs of approach shoes were to much for it. Everything was loose at the crux, and a lot of the rest of the route was suspect. I was on top rope.
I suggest changing the name to "the nine holes out the back of my head from playing roulette". The view was spectacular.

It got two stars dude**
One wheel shy of normal

Aaron McDonald

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2014, 12:49:39 PM »
It got two stars dude**

The only we found were when Jon pulled the hold off and hit himself in the head and said "I see stars."

Jon how many stars did you see?

Aaron McDonald

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2014, 12:54:47 PM »
The Back Nine (attention to detail suggested)


Great Views from on top



NOAL

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2014, 01:07:15 PM »
wow, that is a super cool video!
Quote
Later in the day I blew off a good size hold at the crux of The Back Nine. Aaron used this for both a hand and foothold. My extra 30 lbs plus both pairs of approach shoes were to much for it. Everything was loose at the crux, and a lot of the rest of the route was suspect. I was on top rope.
I suggest changing the name to "the nine holes out the back of my head from playing roulette". The view was spectacular.

Was the hold a golf ball sized cobble that was loose?  The first time I did the route I got totally fixated on that hold.  After looking around a bit I found something better up and to the right to use instead. Knowing that, when I went back to do the route again I did not notice the loose cobble.  In fact, I thought it might have broken off.  If it's gone maybe there's a good pocket there now.

  Fun route that is a good length, well bolted, and in a serene and beautiful location.

Aaron McDonald

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2014, 01:13:44 PM »
After the rain.




JC w KC redux

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2014, 05:04:05 PM »
There is something telling about this post that resonates with me. What it says, I think, is that the FA's subjective experience is deserving of respect despite the "outcome" aka the collective post hoc judgment of the aesthetic qualities of the line.

So many times this antecedent evaluation of aesthetics is born from the "must be fun" commandment. Garbage climbs being, per se not fun. I think at times, without the loss-leading 'crappy' lines being established as a big 'FU' to a collective herd mentality about the supposed value of a climb, we become pushed along the distribution curve to the middle and mediocre.

Exceptionality, in the form of garbage climbs, has a signifying value all it's own in reasserting what the standard deviation can and should be.

Take for example Fritz's story about an FA in the backcountry of Idaho (?) where they climbed several, horribly loose with big blocks, pitches. It was a direct line, but never reported. But in reading about it, the idea of how terrible it was reset my calculation. So horrible you wouldn't ever report it, but it being a directissima, and still no reportage?

Choss is the yin to the yang. The dark to the light. The terrifying to the fun.



You must be the greatest living chosslosopher of all time :)


One wheel shy of normal

mungeclimber

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2014, 05:35:04 PM »
"The unexamined choss is worth climbing."
-Chosscrates
From the Apology For Mud n Crud
On Aid at Pinns... It's all A1 til it crumbles. - Munge

clink

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2014, 05:44:55 PM »
Any good quotes by Ashitpileistotle?
Causing trouble when not climbing.

mungeclimber

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2014, 06:10:49 PM »
"In all things Pinnacles, there is something of the marvelous."

On Aid at Pinns... It's all A1 til it crumbles. - Munge

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2014, 06:15:22 PM »
"hold my beer, this will go clean"
I'm not worthy.

mungeclimber

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2014, 06:18:10 PM »
"hold my beer, this will go clean"

Ubergoober?
On Aid at Pinns... It's all A1 til it crumbles. - Munge

NOAL

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2014, 06:19:40 PM »
"No route is completely worthless.  It can always serve as a bad example"

Brad Young

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Re: "Crappy FAs"
« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2014, 06:35:23 PM »

"No route is completely worthless.  It can always serve as a bad example"


Totally, totally spot on.